00001
  1               HUDSON COUNTY PLANNING BOARD
  2   IN RE:                       )
                                   ) TRANSCRIPT OF
  3        MONTHLY MEETING         ) PROCEEDINGS
                                   )
  4   _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _)
                       Administration Annex
  5                    567 Pavonia Avenue
                       Freeholders Chambers
  6                    Jersey City, New Jersey
                       Wednesday, September 21, 2005
  7                    6:50 p.m.
  8   B E F O R E:
  9        MICHAEL HOLLOWAY, CHAIRMAN
 10        RUSHABH MEHTA, COMMISSIONER
 11        MARY E. AVAGLIANO, COMMISSIONER
 12        RENEE BETTINGER, COMMISSIONER
 13        DANIEL CHOFFO, COMMISSIONER
 14        BORIVOJ JASEK, COMMISSIONER
 15   
      A L S O   P R E S E N T:
 16   
           JAMES SEAMAN, ESQ., Board Attorney
 17   
           STEPHEN MARKS, Board Secretary
 18   
                              Reported By:
 19   
 20                           MICHELLE GRUENDEL, C.S.R.
 21   
              REPORTING SERVICES ARRANGED THROUGH
 22       VERITEXT/NEW JERSEY REPORTING COMPANY, L.L.C.
          Kabot Battaglia & Hammer  Suburban Shorthand
 23       Waga and Spinelli  Arthur J. Frannicola CSR
                       25B Vreeland Road
 24              Florham Park, New Jersey 07932
             Tel: 973-410-4040     Fax: 973-410-1313
 25   
00002
  1                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Meeting called to
  2   order, please.
  3           Steve, has this meeting been properly
  4   advertised?
  5                  MR. SEAMAN:  Yes, Mr. Chairman.  James
  6   Seaman on behalf of Mr. Calvanico.
  7           Notice of this meeting was forwarded for
  8   publication to the Jersey Journal, also forwarded to
  9   the Clerk of the County, Clerk of the Board of Chosen
 10   Freeholders for posting on the boards and the notices
 11   are in compliance with the Open Public Meetings Act.
 12                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Thank you.
 13           Steve, can I have a roll call, please?
 14                  MR. MARKS:  Commissioner Avagliano?
 15                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  Here.
 16                  MR. MARKS:  Commissioner Bettinger?
 17                  COMMISSIONER BETTINGER:  Here.
 18                  MR. MARKS:  Commissioner Choffo?
 19                  COMMISSIONER CHOFFO:  Here.
 20                  MR. MARKS:  Commissioner Dublin is not
 21   present.
 22           Commissioner Fitzgibbons is not present.
 23           Commissioner Jasek?
 24                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Present.
 25                  MR. MARKS:  Commissioner Liggio, not
00003
  1   present.
  2           Commissioner Mehta?
  3                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  Here.
  4                  MR. MARKS:  And Chairman Holloway?
  5                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Here.
  6                  MR. MARKS:  Mr. Chairman, we have a
  7   quorum.
  8                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Thank you.
  9           Can we all please stand, Salute the Flag?
 10           (Flag Salute takes place.)
 11                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Review and
 12   adoption of meeting minutes for August 17th, 2005.
 13           Can I have a motion?
 14                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  Motion to
 15   accept.
 16                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  I will second.
 17                  MR. MARKS:  Mr. Chairman, on a motion
 18   made by Commissioner Avagliano and seconded by
 19   Commissioner Mehta:
 20           Commissioner Bettinger?
 21                  COMMISSIONER BETTINGER:  I'll abstain.
 22                  MR. MARKS:  Commissioner Choffo?
 23                  COMMISSIONER CHOFFO:  Aye.
 24                  MR. MARKS:  Commissioner Jasek?
 25                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Aye.
00004
  1                  MR. MARKS:  Commissioner Avagliano?
  2                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  I voted.  I
  3   made the motion.
  4                  MR. MARKS:  Okay.  Commissioner
  5   Mehta?
  6                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  I seconded it.
  7                  MR. MARKS:  And Chairman Holloway?
  8                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Aye.
  9           Just speak up a little louder so he can hear.
 10                  MR. MARKS:  Mr. Chairman, the motion
 11   passes.
 12                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Thank you.
 13           At this time would anybody from the public
 14   like to speak about the Agenda?
 15           All right, Steve.
 16                  MR. MARKS:  Sure.
 17           Mr. Chairman, Section 6A on the Agenda,
 18   memorialization of resolutions approved at last
 19   meeting:
 20           SP-40-05, Coach House Diner, located at 921
 21   Kennedy Boulevard, North Bergen, New Jersey;
 22   SP-54-05, Carlo Zimatore, located at 7716-7804
 23   Kennedy Boulevard, also in North Bergen; and finally,
 24   SD-80-05, the Jersey City Housing Authority, located
 25   at Woodward and Johnston Avenue, Jersey City, New
00005
  1   Jersey.
  2                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Thank you.
  3           Can I get a motion to approve?
  4                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  Motion to
  5   approve.
  6                  COMMISSIONER BETTINGER:  I'll second
  7   it.
  8                  MR. MARKS:  Mr. Chairman, on a motion
  9   made by Commissioner Avagliano and seconded by
 10   Commissioner Bettinger:
 11           Commissioner Choffo?
 12                  COMMISSIONER CHOFFO:  Aye.
 13                  MR. MARKS:  Commissioner Jasek?
 14                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Aye.
 15                  MR. MARKS:  Commissioner Mehta?
 16                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  Aye.
 17                  MR. MARKS:  Chairman Holloway?
 18                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Aye.
 19                  MR. MARKS:  Mr. Chairman, the motion
 20   passed.
 21                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Thank you.
 22                  MR. MARKS:  Next, Section 6B on the
 23   Agenda, applications declared to be exempt:
 24           SP-82-05, CCMMI, LLC, at 39 Avenue A,
 25   Bayonne, New Jersey; SP-84-05, Omnipoint
00006
  1   Communications, Inc., 105-13th Street, Hoboken, New
  2   Jersey; SD-86-05, New Liberty Residential Urban
  3   Renewal, located at Chapel Avenue, Block 1500, Lots
  4   46, 64, 65 in Jersey City; SP-88-05, Cumberland
  5   Farms, Inc., located at 732 Avenue E in Bayonne, New
  6   Jersey; and SP-89-05, Omnipoint Communications Inc.,
  7   located at 412-422 Harrison Avenue, Harrison, New
  8   Jersey; and SP-90-05, NY SMSA d/b/a Verizon Wireless,
  9   located at 30-32 Central Avenue, Jersey City, New
 10   Jersey.
 11                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Thank you.
 12           Can I get a motion?
 13                  COMMISSIONER CHOFFO:  I'll make a
 14   motion.
 15                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  I second it.
 16                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  Second.
 17                  MR. MARKS:  Mr. Chairman, on a motion
 18   made by Commissioner Choffo and seconded by
 19   Commissioner Jasek:
 20           Commissioner Avagliano?
 21                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  I vote aye.
 22                  MR. MARKS:  Commissioner Bettinger?
 23                  COMMISSIONER BETTINGER:  Aye.
 24                  MR. MARKS:  Commissioner Mehta?
 25                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  Aye.
00007
  1                  MR. MARKS:  Chairman Holloway?
  2                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Aye.
  3                  MR. MARKS:  Mr. Chairman, the motion
  4   passed.
  5                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Thank you.
  6                  MR. MARKS:  Mr. Chairman, the next
  7   item, which is 6C on the Agenda, site plans and
  8   subdivisions scheduled for public hearing:
  9           We have SP/SD-81-05, Hartz Mountain
 10   Industries, Inc., Harbor Boulevard in Weehawken.
 11                  MR. MAGRINI:  Evening, Mr. Chairman.
 12   Allen Magrini, attorney for Hartz Mountain
 13   Industries.
 14           This is a continuation from, I guess a
 15   meeting we commenced last, last month.  At that
 16   meeting we had made the presentation about the
 17   development and we were requested that we provide a
 18   traffic --
 19                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Excuse me one
 20   second.  Is this microphone on?
 21                  MR. MARKS:  It should be.
 22                  MR. MAGRINI:  Should I talk closer?
 23   The volume was down, I think.
 24           Good evening.  Allen Magrini, attorney for
 25   Hartz Mountain Industries.
00008
  1           We're here this evening as a continuation of
  2   an application where we really presented the majority
  3   of the application with regard to the proposed
  4   development, as it was approved by the Town of
  5   Weehawken in August of this year, and at the end of
  6   the meeting we were requested to provide to the
  7   County Engineer and the Planning Office a traffic
  8   impact study, which we did and which was reviewed by
  9   the County's Traffic Consultant.  If you want, I can
 10   go through their comments.
 11                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Yes.  Would you
 12   please?
 13                  MR. MAGRINI:  We basically concur with
 14   them, but there are some items here -- again, it's a
 15   Traffic Analysis done by Medina Consultants dated
 16   September 19, 2005.  The first comment really deals
 17   with, we had spoken about last meeting, and maybe
 18   they weren't here or didn't have the benefit of being
 19   here, the municipal project for the complete
 20   reconstruction of Baldwin Avenue.  As we discussed --
 21   maybe I'll show you on the Site Plan.  I'll speak
 22   loud.  Again, Baldwin Avenue in its current
 23   configuration is a very secruitous (phonetic) road
 24   that's two lanes.  It goes under and between the
 25   columns for the Lincoln Har -- Lincoln Tunnel
00009
  1   heelex.  It is a very difficult road and it runs a
  2   very short distance, really, from Boulevard East to
  3   Harbor Boulevard in Lincoln Harbor, and it's several
  4   hundred feet in length, but it's a critical road to
  5   the entire Hudson River Waterfront.  There's an
  6   ongoing project by the Town of Weehawken for the
  7   complete reconstruction of Baldwin Avenue to a full,
  8   five-lane road.  Again, today it's only two lanes.
  9   As we talked about at the last session, I believe
 10   from 2001 in the Federal Safety Legislation there's
 11   about $2 million, $2.5 million earmarked for this.
 12   In the 2005 Federal Transportation there's an
 13   additional $2 million, and The Port Authority has
 14   committed some $2.5 million to it, approximately $7.5
 15   million roadway reconstruction project.
 16           As we discussed, Hartz and Roseland
 17   Properties, our neighbor, but really Hartz is part of
 18   the Lincoln Harbor Residential Development, and even
 19   before that has been required by the town and has
 20   committed to the town that, one, any lands within
 21   Lincoln Harbor that is needed for the reconstruction
 22   of that intersection of Baldwin Avenue, we will
 23   dedicate to the town at no cost, which is a
 24   significant contribution.  Roseland and Hartz are
 25   jointly funding the design of the project, which is a
00010
  1   significant project, significant design costs, and
  2   we've guaranteed the town that we will make-up any
  3   shortfall between public monies that are available
  4   and the actual cost of the project.  We will share 50
  5   percent of any of those costs, so it's a very
  6   significant roadway improvement.
  7           The status of it right now is the town has
  8   selected, and it's early on, Parsons Brinkerhauf to
  9   do the design on behalf of the municipality.  Again,
 10   Hartz and Roseland are going to fund that design, and
 11   the current estimates are approximately $800,000 just
 12   for the design, so it's a very significant
 13   contribution.  Because it connects to Kennedy
 14   Boulevard East, which is a county road, the County
 15   Engineering Department's going to have -- obviously
 16   play an active role in this design process, so, in
 17   the design process you have it being a Town of
 18   Weehawken project with Federal funding, Port
 19   Authority funding, County participation, because it
 20   intersects with Boulevard East, a county road, and
 21   New Jersey Department of Transportation, because they
 22   manage the design process and the expenditure of the
 23   Federal funding that's part of the project, so you
 24   have all the appropriate transportation agencies in
 25   there and looking at it.  Again, Medina wasn't here
00011
  1   at the last hearing, so they didn't have the benefit,
  2   I guess, of some of the presentation, but that's the
  3   design process that is in place here.  That becomes a
  4   full, four-way signalized intersection, and again,
  5   this is, this is dated, but this is a preliminary
  6   concept that Hartz had prepared working with the Town
  7   of Weehawken.  Again, Boulevard East on the top of
  8   the drawing, Baldwin Avenue, down here is the Hudson
  9   River and Lincoln Harbor.  Today, Baldwin Avenue is
 10   two lanes and it has this route here, the secruitous
 11   route that you come -- you used to have to actually
 12   cross the railroad tracks.  It was terrible, flashing
 13   lights.  Hartz, with Weehawken, when the light rail
 14   was constructed, this is the new light rail paths.
 15   We worked with the light rail people to get the light
 16   rail elevated at this point, and it's now constructed
 17   and elevated so that the new Baldwin Avenue will
 18   actually come down, again, these are the columns for
 19   the heelex, and now will go underneath the elevated
 20   light rail so there will not be any --
 21                  MR. REIMON:  Excuse me.
 22                  MR. MAGRINI: -- there will not be any
 23   rail vehicular conflicts at that point.  The rail is
 24   up in the air, come down to a nice -- this is
 25   projected, at least, this concept, as five lanes.
00012
  1   There will be two left turn lanes in from Boulevard
  2   East, two left turns out from Boulevard East, on to
  3   Boulevard East, and again, down to a new signalized
  4   four-way intersection at Harbor Boulevard and
  5   Waterfront Terrace.  Again, this is a preliminary
  6   concept that Hartz did just to show that we have the
  7   lands and that can work.  Weehawken, again, has
  8   retained Parsons Brinkerhauf to do the real design,
  9   so this is really just a good example of the
 10   magnitude of the improvement and the significant
 11   improvement that will make the traffic flow in this
 12   area.
 13           The second part of their first comment really
 14   deals with, that the presence of the Bergen --
 15   Hudson/Bergen Light Rail is encouraged to use mass
 16   transit in this area, and we did discuss that last,
 17   at the last session, and maybe I can do two comments
 18   at one time.  One is the discussion about the light
 19   rail, and the second one, which is comment number,
 20   number two in their report, reads:  The traffic study
 21   for Lincoln Harbor did not address future pedestrian
 22   traffic which will be generated by the new
 23   residential development, and since that's a change
 24   from commercial development -- and what this is, is a
 25   Pedestrian Circulation Plan, which I believe we put
00013
  1   in the record last time, prepared by Hartz.  It was
  2   an exhibit before the Weehawken Planning Board and
  3   approved by them.  Again, this is the residential
  4   development that we're talking about at this point,
  5   and again, these 430 units replace previously
  6   approved 584,000 square feet of office.  That's now
  7   eliminated from this plan.  Plus, what was up here
  8   was a 135 room hotel.  That's now eliminated, and you
  9   have 430 residential units.  This northerly one acre
 10   here is now going to be open space dedicated to the
 11   town to complement the existing park that Hartz built
 12   and maintains at this intersection.
 13           With regard to pedestrian circulation, again,
 14   Lincoln Harbor always enjoys this here, the
 15   waterfront walkway that's built through the majority
 16   of Lincoln Harbor.  The last piece is the connection
 17   to Hoboken, but the balance -- all that waterfront
 18   walkway is in place.  As part of the last approval
 19   from Weehawken, the town has also required that we
 20   construct, along the rear of Lincoln Harbor, a new
 21   pedestrian bike way, two paths bifurcated, like an
 22   eight-foot wide bike way, four-foot landscaped medium
 23   and a five-foot walkway, so you'll either -- and
 24   then, as part of the Baldwin Avenue reconstruction,
 25   that bike way and walkway provision will be taken up
00014
  1   to Boulevard East.  Similar provisions are made today
  2   going out 19th Street, so what you'll have in Lincoln
  3   Harbor in terms of pedestrian is the full waterfront
  4   walkway, which is both pedestrian and bicycle, and
  5   also a redundant system along the bike -- the rear of
  6   Lincoln Harbor, which, again, will be pedestrian and
  7   bike way.  As part of that, to coordinate with the
  8   light rail -- the light rail station has been built
  9   and exists at this point in Lincoln Harbor.  As part
 10   of this walkway, bike way, there will be bike racks
 11   installed by Hartz near the light rail station for
 12   people who want to take their bike down there and use
 13   the light rail for commuting purposes.  We now have
 14   approved with the New Jersey Department of
 15   Transportation a pedestrian crossing signal at that
 16   point, so if you take the light rail and you get off,
 17   they'll be a pedestrian crossing signal to bring you
 18   across Waterfront Terrace into Lincoln Harbor.  As
 19   part of this garage that's being built, there's also
 20   built into this corner a pedestrian waiting area.  It
 21   will be aluminum and glass doors where you can come
 22   off the train, come into a water tight area, again,
 23   cross at the traffic light that we're installing,
 24   into an, I guess it's a vestibule where you could be
 25   dry until somebody either comes to pick you up or
00015
  1   whatever, however, you're being dropped off in the
  2   morning and it's inclement weather, you can stay here
  3   until the train comes and then cross the street, so
  4   again, I don't think they had the benefit of the
  5   presentation, but one of the reasons we really like
  6   this site is its proximity to the light rail.  We do
  7   provide for all paved sidewalks, that you can come
  8   out of the development, walk to a traffic light,
  9   cross the street into the light rail.  We've also
 10   provided for, again, a new bike way, walkway that
 11   leads you from Weehawken, again, as far as we can go
 12   on the property to the light rail station.  That's
 13   one of the critical elements here.  We're excited by
 14   the light rail.
 15           As we talked a little bit last time, this
 16   development is a leading development in terms of mass
 17   transit of the whole waterfront.  When it was first
 18   commenced, Lincoln Harbor, we have significant bus
 19   service in there.  We have a ferry stop here that we
 20   operate, and it's run by New York Waterways, and that
 21   provides ferry service to the patrons and residents
 22   of Lincoln Harbor, and now we have the light rail, so
 23   we really have a convergence of all of the mass
 24   transit facilities right into Lincoln Harbor, and
 25   again, when you come out of the light rail pedestrian
00016
  1   crossing, you'll have a raised paver, walk, you know,
  2   through the streets so you know where you are,
  3   appropriate stop signs, appropriate paths bringing
  4   you from back there, either along the central road
  5   here or through a path along our buildings into the
  6   concourse of the building you can come, so pedestrian
  7   circulation is critical to us.  I don't know if
  8   you've been to Lincoln Harbor recently, but it's a
  9   very exciting, very upscale development, and we're
 10   just taking it to the next step with this residence.
 11   That's one of the things that's been missing, is more
 12   people here.  You have a point where there's going to
 13   be 250 units, and this will be 430 additional
 14   residential units, so it will truly add that 24 hour,
 15   you know, seven day a week excitement, and it will
 16   also complement the activity at the marina, so we're
 17   very excited about that.
 18           I don't mean to be going back over stuff that
 19   I presented last meeting.
 20                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  It's okay.  The
 21   other part I just, really, I think, because, again,
 22   they weren't at the last meeting, Medina report talks
 23   about the existing Baldwin Avenue is only 22-feet
 24   wide, and that's correct, and they talk about adding
 25   more traffic to that roadway can only increase
00017
  1   accidents and danger, and we agree, and that's why
  2   the town is requiring that we participate.
  3                  MR. MAGRINI:  We're working with the
  4   town to completely reconstruct that road, so now it's
  5   a very nice, instead of 22-foot wide, it's now a
  6   five-lane, fully signalized roadway that will come
  7   through here to address all those issues.  Again,
  8   this is very preliminary.  The County Engineers will
  9   be involved in this whole design, but that's
 10   basically where it's going to go, because you have
 11   columns that you have to -- and the light rail is
 12   actually elevated at these points here, so, I mean,
 13   you know where it's going to start and you know where
 14   it's going to end.  It's a matter of some of the
 15   geometry in the middle that's really up for change
 16   and design, but that's going to be a design process
 17   that's going to commence, or has really commenced,
 18   but will probably take the next six months, and the
 19   real goal is to hopefully have this improvement under
 20   construction come this early spring, early summer.  I
 21   think that really addresses the engineering, you
 22   know, and the traffic comments here.
 23                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Okay.  Bob, do you
 24   have any comments?
 25                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Yes, Mr.
00018
  1   Chairman.
  2           First, I would like to see the resolution
  3   from the Town of Weehawken and make sure that there
  4   are no conditions which adversely influence our
  5   decision.
  6                  MR. MAGRINI:  I highlighted at least
  7   the page that deals with the -- I don't know if you
  8   want -- Commissioners?
  9                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Yeah.
 10                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Thank you.
 11                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  Thank you.
 12                  MR. MAGRINI:  You're welcome.
 13           As you see on page 11, that highlighted
 14   condition talks about the Baldwin Avenue improvement
 15   project and the Hartz obligation to fund up to 50
 16   percent of the project, which we've agreed to do.
 17   That 50 percent contribution is for the dollars to
 18   design and construct, and again, the shortfall in
 19   that, but in addition to that, to contribute any
 20   lands that are needed for this.  What will happen is,
 21   you'll see the existing Baldwin Avenue roadway comes
 22   well out here.  When the new one is constructed there
 23   are some excess lands that we will give to the town
 24   to incorporate back into the one-and-a-half acre park
 25   that's adjacent to that, so, if anything, the park
00019
  1   pieces will get larger.
  2           When you start to think from the county's
  3   point in terms of traffic, obviously that's a
  4   significant improvement here, but also, in terms of
  5   the amenities out here, this is an existing park
  6   built and maintained, this is an addition at one acre
  7   of open space that we're now dedicating to the
  8   municipality, and you have the whole walkway and,
  9   again, new walkway, bike way along the rear of the
 10   property that will provide spectacular access, both
 11   vehicular with the new Baldwin Avenue mass transit
 12   and pedestrian.
 13                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Mr. Chairman,
 14   very briefly, the condition deals only with Baldwin
 15   Avenue, and the applicant presented a very grand
 16   plan, how to improve the Baldwin Avenue, but Baldwin
 17   Avenue is not my concern, not the major one.  The
 18   major concern is the 19th Street and Park Avenue.
 19   Right now the intersection works on the condition F,
 20   which is fair, completely fair.  Now we are adding a
 21   number of other cars.  It's something like 218 in the
 22   morning and 270 in the afternoon.  It's not going to
 23   help.  According to the traffic report, they say that
 24   the present condition is F, which is the worst one.
 25   The new condition after the buildup will be F.  Of
00020
  1   course there is nothing worse than F, so it does not
  2   satisfy me, and that's a major problem with this
  3   project.  It needs to deal with the traffic on 19th
  4   Street and Park Avenue.  It will be major access in
  5   and out from this development.
  6           Let me just point to a few things.
  7           The letter from Wilber Smith, which was
  8   received by the town and answered by your traffic
  9   consultant, mentions six questions.  I went through
 10   the report and I find only five answers.  I wonder
 11   what is the one question which is missing.  Could you
 12   enlighten us on that?
 13                  MR. MAGRINI:  No.  I mean, I don't
 14   understand which five you are -- but what I can tell
 15   you is that we've been through this entire process.
 16   You have the resolution there from the Planning
 17   Board, which is for preliminary and final site plan
 18   approval, which was based on all the traffic
 19   information that we've submitted to this Board.
 20   Weehawken has done a very extensive review -- again,
 21   we've been through multiple times with Wilber Smith
 22   Associates the improvement program that the town is
 23   determined, that we concur with, that's necessary to
 24   make this work, Baldwin Avenue.  There's no
 25   question.  There are other intersections in this
00021
  1   area -- I mean, we're at the mouth of the Lincoln
  2   Tunnel out here, and the only issue is if you are
  3   going to stop all the development on the other front,
  4   that's a difficult decision to make.  This
  5   residential has minor impacts on it.  Again, there
  6   was an approval for 584,000 square feet of office
  7   space.  The switch to this project reduces in the
  8   a.m. peak by 762 vehicles and in the p.m. peak --
  9                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Well, I have a
 10   problem.  In this traffic report it says previous
 11   approval for the hotel and office space.  It was
 12   never approved by this body.  It was approved by the
 13   town.  The town's concern is not with 19th Street.
 14   They throw it to the county.  19th Street is a county
 15   intersection and the town insists now that county
 16   improves 19th Street intersection.
 17                  MR. MAGRINI:  And we've done
 18   significant work.  I mean, I think the county was --
 19   and someone in the County Engineering, I don't think
 20   the Planning Board back when Lincoln Harbor was
 21   started was active at that point.
 22           Particularly --
 23                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Absolutely.
 24                  MR. MAGRINI: -- 19th Street, you go
 25   out there and look today, it's a very wide,
00022
  1   bifurcated street on the land that we own, and that
  2   very significant roadway improvement --
  3                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Yes.  It was for
  4   the first one.
  5                  MR. MAGRINI: -- there's an elevated
  6   overpass to bring a second means of ingress into
  7   Lincoln Harbor.  This way here, we've made the
  8   revisions for the light rail.  I mean, we've done
  9   significant -- you look at 19th Street and this, the
 10   site adjacent to Lincoln Harbor, and again, it's
 11   outside of Lincoln Harbor, the piece we're talking
 12   about, it's the main entrance in, but it's a public
 13   road, was all reconstructed and rebuilt.  The
 14   adjacent roads are the roads that really haven't been
 15   built, but a lot of that has to do with, again, its
 16   location at the throat of the Lincoln Tunnel and the
 17   heelex and the existing development up along Willow
 18   Avenue and Park Avenue.  None of those properties
 19   that we own.  I think we've always come to the county
 20   when we had to -- we are willing to step up and do
 21   significant improvements.  Again, we have a billion
 22   dollars worth of money invested out here, you know.
 23   We're looking to do a substantial investment in a
 24   very significant residential project, so we're not
 25   looking to shy away from traffic improvements.  We're
00023
  1   making a very serious commitment there.  If there are
  2   specific things with regard to 19th Avenue, the
  3   traffic report doesn't address them, they've not been
  4   raised with us until this minute, really.
  5                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Well, yes, as I
  6   said, the town has an interest in Baldwin Avenue.
  7   The county has an interest in 19th Street.  They are
  8   two different aspects.
  9                  MR. MAGRINI:  Well, Baldwin Avenue
 10   intersection with Kennedy Boulevard East is the same
 11   as the 19th Street intersection with Kennedy
 12   Boulevard East.  I do submit you have a very large
 13   and should have a very large interest in Baldwin
 14   Avenue and Kennedy Boulevard.  That's the main
 15   entrance to not only Lincoln Harbor, but also to the
 16   Roseland projects all the way up to the new ferry
 17   station up through Pershing Road.  This is a critical
 18   intersection.  Again, you have the Federal Government
 19   and Port Authority contributing several million
 20   dollars, Hartz, Roseland contributing undetermined
 21   amounts of money at this point, so that's a very
 22   significant thing and I don't think you can just
 23   ignore it.  It's a major --
 24                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  And I do
 25   appreciate it.  I heard it twice, but my concern is
00024
  1   19th Street, so let's talk about 19th Street.
  2                  MR. REIMON:  May I say something
  3   here?
  4                  MR. SEAMAN:  The witness, I believe,
  5   should be sworn.
  6                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Yes.
  7   EDWIN A. REIMON, P.E., having been first duly sworn
  8   according to law, testified as follows:
  9                  MR. REIMON:  My name is Edwin Reimon
 10   from Medina Consultants.
 11           I just want to say that we reviewed, as you
 12   saw already, and you concur with what we submitted to
 13   the county as our work, review of the site, of the
 14   traffic analysis that was submitted to us.
 15                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Excuse me.
 16                  MR. REIMON:  The only document, the
 17   only documents that we have is a Traffic Assessment
 18   Study that was done in 2005, and also the Traffic
 19   Analysis that was done for Phase III of the
 20   development.
 21                  MR. MAGRINI:  Yes.
 22                  MR. REIMON:  Okay.  Now, what I would
 23   like to say at this point is that --
 24                  MR. MAGRINI:  These two reports?
 25                  MR. REIMON: -- in report -- the thick
00025
  1   one is a very thorough report --
  2                  MR. MAGRINI:  Yes.
  3                  MR. REIMON: -- compared to this
  4   Traffic Assessment Study.  Now, it's true that the
  5   Traffic Assessment Study actually is supported by
  6   that document, but there is, there are several issues
  7   in here that we see.
  8           One issue is that that traffic study for
  9   Phase III was done in 2001 and the built condition on
 10   that traffic study is year 2003.  This Traffic
 11   Assessment Study is done in 2005 with built condition
 12   2010, so we have seven years difference between built
 13   conditions.  Okay?  That's number one.  We didn't say
 14   that in our report because our report was based on
 15   comments that were made by the Municipality of
 16   Weehawken on this report, okay, and we review what we
 17   have in hand.  We didn't have any of the plans that
 18   you're showing here.  We couldn't make -- I didn't
 19   want to speculate, but I had a good feeling of what
 20   was going on.  As you said already, that, you know,
 21   the same is going to be done on Baldwin Avenue.  Now,
 22   the County Engineer has a very good concern.  Why
 23   Baldwin Avenue and not 19th Street?  I say this,
 24   Baldwin Avenue, it doesn't matter what you do there
 25   because you're going to have a lot of constraints on
00026
  1   Baldwin Avenue because it's a facility -- you have
  2   facilities from The Port Authority, they have more
  3   than four driveways, and as you know, they have
  4   emergencies and they have to go.  Okay?  That's
  5   number one.
  6           Number two, anything you do as far as
  7   geometry in Baldwin Avenue, as you show here, I would
  8   like to see how they are going to address the
  9   geometry issues that you're gonna' have going from
 10   this point to this point here.  You have clearance
 11   underneath the bridge in here.  This is where the
 12   existing Baldwin Avenue is.
 13                  MR. MAGRINI:  That gets closed.
 14                  MR. REIMON:  It's very tight as far
 15   as --
 16                  MR. MAGRINI:  It's closed.
 17                  MR. REIMON: -- the clearance.
 18                  MR. MAGRINI:  The vertical clearance
 19   is here, where it has been elevated.  The light rail
 20   has been specifically constructed at grade.  It
 21   elevates specifically for the extension of Baldwin
 22   Avenue.  You get down to these two columns here,
 23   there's adequate height, and it was built just in the
 24   last three years to handle all the emergency vehicles
 25   and all the vehicles and trucks that will be coming
00027
  1   through here, so that's been taken care of and taken
  2   in -- with regard to the Port Authority, who's
  3   properties are up in here, Port Authority's committed
  4   over $2 million to this project.  They know what
  5   they're getting into.  They see this as the critical
  6   thing from the, from the heelex --
  7                  MR. REIMON:  Yeah.
  8                  MR. MAGRINI: -- to the waterfront.
  9                  MR. REIMON:  Yeah.
 10                  MR. MAGRINI:  They have air shafts
 11   over here, so they're very, very involved, and they
 12   know they have four driveways.
 13                  MR. REIMON:  Listen, all I'm saying is
 14   this, to you --
 15                  MR. MAGRINI:  So it's not --
 16                  MR. REIMON:  All I'm saying to the
 17   Board and to you is this, you have two access points
 18   to the waterfront right now.  These two access points
 19   are 19 and Baldwin.  19 street is very wide.  At this
 20   time 19th Street has two lanes of traffic going into
 21   the waterfront already.
 22                  MR. MAGRINI:  Right.
 23                  MR. REIMON:  It has four lanes of
 24   traffic, three lanes of traffic going through and
 25   left -- and one channelized right turn lane into
00028
  1   Kennedy Boulevard East.  Okay?
  2                  MR. MAGRINI:  Correct.
  3                  MR. REIMON:  So you have
  4   infrastructure already, already in place.
  5                  MR. MAGRINI:  That we built, yes.
  6                  MR. REIMON:  At 19th Street?
  7                  MR. MAGRINI:  Yes.
  8                  MR. REIMON:  You do not have
  9   infrastructure in place at Baldwin Avenue.  You have
 10   to spend millions of dollars to improve Baldwin
 11   Avenue.
 12                  MR. MAGRINI:  That's right.
 13                  MR. REIMON:  Why don't you bring your
 14   traffic to 19th Street?  You don't have to spend $2
 15   million.  All you have to do is widen Boulevard East
 16   to provide storage for left turn lane into the
 17   waterfront.
 18                  MR. MAGRINI:  With regard to Baldwin,
 19   with regard to Baldwin Avenue, that's not my
 20   project.  If you have a problem with that project, I
 21   submit to you, you have to deal with Mayor Turner and
 22   you have to deal with the Town of Weehawken.
 23                  MR. REIMON:  I'm just bringing --
 24                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  What we're --
 25                  MR. MAGRINI:  I'm saying, they made
00029
  1   that a priority project.  That's not something I can
  2   walk away --
  3                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Is there a reason
  4   we're not addressing 19th Street?
  5                  MR. MAGRINI:  To be honest with you,
  6   now is the first time I've heard anything about 19th
  7   Street, so I've, I'm -- if there's a specific request
  8   or recommendation, I'd like to hear it.
  9                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  It addresses it
 10   in the original Traffic Impact Study from 2001, and
 11   it says that it's not feasible to do anything else.
 12   There is two sentences about it.  It's not addressing
 13   it so the new addition to the Traffic Assessment
 14   Study which was done this year would be the same
 15   thing.  It still repeats that previously approved
 16   project with the hotel and the office spaces will
 17   save 700 feet, but the project, as I said, was never
 18   approved by this Board, so it's not approved, so we
 19   cannot argue that what was proposed before and not
 20   build is what's much worse than what's proposed now.
 21   If it was approved by this Board, then yes, it's a
 22   matter of fact.
 23                  MR. REIMON:  I couldn't finish my --
 24                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Sorry.  Go ahead.
 25                  MR. REIMON:  Then don't get me wrong,
00030
  1   all I'm saying is that you have already
  2   infrastructure in place at 19th Street versus what
  3   you have at Baldwin Avenue.
  4                  MR. MAGRINI:  Yes.
  5                  MR. REIMON:  Now, that's issue number
  6   one.
  7           Number two, why this -- I mean, Waterfront
  8   Terrace, right, is a road that is just two lanes, one
  9   in each direction.  That, I believe by the year that
 10   I was -- I mean, I been in Hudson County many years.
 11   That road ends right at the parking lot and then all
 12   of a sudden got to say to me to build -- I mean, this
 13   Harbor Boulevard right turns to the right, to the
 14   east and then to the Boulevard.
 15                  MR. MAGRINI:  Right.
 16                  MR. REIMON:  Right, which is right
 17   here.
 18                  MR. MAGRINI:  This?
 19                  MR. REIMON:  Right.  That's what it is
 20   today.  Now, this was intended just to provide access
 21   to the parking lot.  Again, why don't we look into
 22   traffic coming -- or measures to encourage people to
 23   use more of this mass transportation network that
 24   we're building here?  Like you just said, we going to
 25   have -- you showed me what I didn't have before,
00031
  1   which is the pedestrian circulation in here, which is
  2   very good, actually.  I mean, this is really nice,
  3   but the thing is, do we really need to have
  4   Waterfront Terrace connected to Port Imperial?
  5                  MR. MAGRINI:  Yes.  Yes, you do.  I'm
  6   going to tell you exactly why we've gone through
  7   them.
  8                  MR. REIMON:  Let me try --
  9                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Excuse me.  All
 10   comments should come through the Chair, please.
 11                  MR. REIMON:  So if there is a reason
 12   for that Waterfront Terrace to be connected to --
 13                  MR. MAGRINI:  Yes.
 14                  MR. REIMON: -- Port Imperial
 15   Boulevard, because that's -- to me, that's a main
 16   reason to put a traffic signal there.
 17                  MR. MAGRINI:  That's right.
 18                  MR. REIMON:  Because if you just have
 19   Baldwin and Harbor Boulevard, you don't really need a
 20   traffic signal, you can just put a stop sign, but if
 21   you have a four-leg intersection, definitely you
 22   going to need a traffic signal there, so --
 23                  MR. MAGRINI:  That's right.
 24                  MR. REIMON: -- there should be just,
 25   you have to justify bringing Waterfront Terrace to --
00032
  1                  MR. MAGRINI:  And I guess --
  2                  MR. REIMON: -- Port --
  3                  MR. MAGRINI: -- my explanation of it
  4   really is, over the years, I mean, we have been in
  5   front of the Weehawken Planning Board and town for
  6   probably 20 years on this project.  The northern
  7   piece up here, by Roseland, has been in front of the
  8   town for many, many years.  All have determined that
  9   the weak point in the entire system is Baldwin
 10   Avenue, with this current configuration.  I got to
 11   tell you, I've never heard a traffic engineer not
 12   have major problems with that intersection.  I mean,
 13   it's a disaster when you get down there.  Again, we
 14   had -- New Jersey Transit probably spent an
 15   additional million dollars to elevate the light rail
 16   there, because they determined it makes sense.  You
 17   have the Federal Government and the Department of
 18   Transportation funding $5 million, because this road
 19   connection clean up makes sense, and The Port
 20   Authority, which, again, owns the facilities.  Now,
 21   Waterfront Terrace being brought through is something
 22   that municipalities are requiring Hartz to do.  Up
 23   at, starting back at this point, it's going to become
 24   four lanes.  We do have to widen it, we do have to
 25   bring it straight across, and the municipality,
00033
  1   Weehawken is requiring, and I think all the traffic
  2   engineers have agreed, this has to become a true,
  3   four-way signalized intersection.
  4                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Again, we can
  5   appreciate that with Baldwin Avenue, but you're still
  6   not addressing 19th Street, which is the county's.
  7                  MR. MAGRINI:  And I guess all I'm
  8   saying is the county's interest at 19th Street is the
  9   same interest here.  It's Kennedy Boulevard.  It's
 10   not 19th Street.  All I'm saying is, if there's a
 11   suggestion here tonight on what we can do there or
 12   what we can help you with, I haven't heard it.  All
 13   I'm saying, I'm not here to argue.  All I want, to
 14   let you know that we're into this for millions of
 15   dollars.  We're not hiding from transportation
 16   improvements here.
 17                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Bob, is there
 18   anything that the county is looking for?
 19                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Yes.  Weehawken
 20   is asking the county to add another traffic lane
 21   going south on Kennedy Boulevard East at 19th
 22   Street.  Otherwise, asking for one right turn lane,
 23   one straight lane and one left turn lane, in
 24   addition, two traffic lanes going north, so we need
 25   to have five traffic lanes in 40-foot wide roadway,
00034
  1   which is impossible at this point.  Traffic lane is,
  2   minimum, 11 feet, so we need cooperation with the
  3   applicant for getting the property, for widening of
  4   the Boulevard to accumulate this traffic.
  5                  MR. MAGRINI:  And again, that's
  6   Kennedy Boulevard.  On Kennedy Boulevard, it's not in
  7   Lincoln Harbor.  Again, this is Lincoln Harbor, which
  8   is subject to the application.  We do own an
  9   adjoining property up here, and that's The City
 10   Group, City Corp. Building right at the intersection
 11   there.  That's the one piece of land we own out
 12   here.  We do not own anything else on Kennedy
 13   Boulevard.
 14           Okay.  Now, you're saying the county would be
 15   seeking additional right-of-way along that entire
 16   frontage, a portion of that frontage?
 17                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  From 19th Street
 18   along the east side of the road for the distance of
 19   about 250 feet.
 20                  MR. MAGRINI:  Again, it's a fully
 21   developed property, so I don't know the dimension of
 22   the request, how much land is needed.  Again, it's a
 23   very secured property.  Believe me, the tenant in
 24   there is very secured and conscience in that, so
 25   you'll see that property is well-fenced, very
00035
  1   well-maintained.  I don't know what right-of-way out
  2   there today, but we would work with you.
  3           Listen, if it's an improvement to the
  4   intersection, again, we have a billion dollars we
  5   spent out here in buildings that we own, and we don't
  6   leave, we're here for many, many years.  We have been
  7   here for 20 years.  We're in a significant
  8   development.  If there are things that can be done
  9   here, that we can be helpful for, we didn't shy away
 10   from Baldwin Avenue, we're not gonna' shy away
 11   with -- we have to help you with some land, we can do
 12   that, but all I have to do is understand it.  I can't
 13   say, you know, we'll give you whatever you need,
 14   because if that's 30 feet, I know we can't do that.
 15   If it's a reasonable amount to help with a lane and
 16   it doesn't negatively impact the building, again, we
 17   don't occupy or tenant occupies, we'll work with you,
 18   we've always done that, so I think, as a condition of
 19   an approval, we would commit to work with the County
 20   Engineer to whatever we can help on that, in terms
 21   of, if there's land needed for an additional widening
 22   out in front of a portion of this property and
 23   physically can be done, we'll do that.
 24                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Bob, is it feet
 25   that we're talking about?
00036
  1                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  We are looking
  2   for 10 feet passed the existing right-of-way, which
  3   would be sufficient for the project, which county
  4   would build.  What we are asking the applicant, to
  5   secure that piece of the property.
  6                  MR. MAGRINI:  So roughly 10 feet by
  7   250 feet?
  8                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  That's correct.
  9                  MR. MAGRINI:  I have to go look at our
 10   survey.  You know, it's not in this application
 11   because it's not part of it, but I would ask the
 12   Board to approve this condition on us working with
 13   the town.  If there's any way we could donate the 10
 14   feet, we would do that.  Again, it's improvement in
 15   front of our property.  We can work with you on that.
 16                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Well, without
 17   this improvement, we don't feel that it will work,
 18   and pretty soon there will be traffic from all
 19   directions even worse than it is now.  Baldwin Avenue
 20   is not really a major exit, because from Baldwin
 21   Avenue, you have -- in this new proposed condition
 22   you will have one traffic lane going north, two
 23   traffic lanes going south.  If you are going south,
 24   you hit 19th Street and you are stopped dead.  You
 25   are not moving nowhere, so 19th Street is really key
00037
  1   to all these improvements.
  2                  MR. MAGRINI:  Again, if that's what
  3   you're looking for, we said we'll work with you.  If
  4   there's any way to do it, we'll do it.  I mean, I
  5   don't have a survey on that property here.  We'd have
  6   to go out and stake it out, see what 10 feet is from
  7   the right-of-way.  I think when you go out there
  8   today, there's no sidewalk, right, there's a curb, I
  9   believe it's grass and then -- up to our fence and
 10   then there's a parking lot obviously inside the
 11   fence, so where the right-of-way is, I don't know
 12   right now.
 13                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Right.  Right now
 14   the right-of-way is --
 15                  MR. MAGRINI:  I don't know if it's at
 16   the curb line.
 17                  COMMISSIONER JASEK: -- about 10 feet
 18   from the curb.
 19                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Are you saying,
 20   Bob, that you need a commitment from them before the
 21   Board could actually, in your opinion, approve this?
 22                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  That's correct,
 23   because, Mr. Chairman, this project will not work
 24   without this improvement, the 19th Street.
 25                  COMMISSIONER BETTINGER:  Mr. Chairman,
00038
  1   I wasn't here at last month's meeting, but why wasn't
  2   the applicant told this at last month's meeting?
  3                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Well, we just
  4   received -- based on last meeting, we received the
  5   traffic report.
  6                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Right.  We didn't
  7   have the traffic report.
  8                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  We didn't have
  9   any, any information, what was proposed to be done.
 10                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  I think the
 11   applicant, if I'm saying this correctly, you didn't
 12   feel that you really needed to be in front of us, it
 13   was mostly a courtesy; am I correct?
 14                  MR. MAGRINI:  I still believe that,
 15   yes, it was a jurisdiction question, but again, it's
 16   not something we're going to shy away from.  We're
 17   here, obviously I'm willing to talk, to work with
 18   you, we will commit to do, to phys -- if we can
 19   physically do this, we will donate that land to the
 20   county.  I mean, if it's going to come through and
 21   take parking, that's another issue, obviously, but --
 22                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  But you do
 23   understand the concern with the engineer?  You're
 24   saying if you can, you would, but what if you can't?
 25   Our engineer is saying that if you don't give it to
00039
  1   us, then it's going to be a problem down the road.
  2   That's why you're in front of this Board, for
  3   traffic.
  4                  MR. MAGRINI:  No.  I guess the Town of
  5   Weehawken, who lives here, has made a determination
  6   that this is a critical project and they want to do
  7   that.  We have a resolution for preliminary and final
  8   approval.  You know, the waterfront is the gold
  9   coast.  There's been determinations by the state that
 10   this is where development should happen.  Again,
 11   nobody's looking for a free ride here.  Billions of
 12   dollars of light rail are put in place.  We're here,
 13   we're looking to do that.  What I'm saying, if we
 14   can't do it, it's because we physically can't do it.
 15   I mean, I can't give you the front wall of the
 16   building.  I can't give you 20 parking spaces from an
 17   existing, occupied building.  If it's a landscaped
 18   area, I can do that.  I can move the fence.  I don't
 19   mind that.
 20                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Let me ask you a
 21   question, please.
 22           Have you reviewed this property --
 23                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Mr. Chairman,
 24   physically, it's possible.
 25                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  That's what I
00040
  1   wanted to ask you.
  2                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  We are not
  3   cutting the corner of the building or we are not --
  4   no.  Physically, it's possible.
  5                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  I don't want to
  6   mislead this Board here.  You mention a building.  We
  7   don't want to tear down a building.
  8                  MR. MAGRINI:  I understand you don't.
  9   We're not here -- the building, believe me, it's
 10   not --
 11                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  If the space is
 12   there, if the space is there, we're asking if you can
 13   purchase that so this application can go through.
 14                  MR. MAGRINI:  No.  If the land is
 15   there, I own it and I will dedicate it to the county
 16   free of cost.  We'll give you a perpetual easement
 17   for that there.  I'll put on the record, perpetual
 18   easement, free of cost to the county for the road
 19   improvement.  Again, we live at the end of that road,
 20   so we're not looking to avoid it.  All I'm saying is,
 21   I do have tenants and I have a built site and I
 22   believe there may be enough land there, and if there
 23   is, we have no problem at all.
 24                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  You do understand
 25   our concern?
00041
  1                  MR. MAGRINI:  Yeah.  We share it.
  2   We -- you know, so I would ask the Board to approve
  3   it with the condition that we work with the engineer,
  4   and if there's no physical -- we can put language,
  5   very strong physical impediment to this, you know, if
  6   we don't lose parking or, you know, that it doesn't
  7   affect the building, I know --
  8                  COMMISSIONER CHOFFO:  Mr. Magrini, our
  9   concern is Hoboken is within 500 feet, 1,000 feet,
 10   maybe, and we're not just dealing with Weehawken.  We
 11   have to deal with every municipality in the county.
 12                  MR. MAGRINI:  Sure.
 13                  COMMISSIONER CHOFFO:  So it's just,
 14   our main concern is traffic and bottlenecks and all
 15   that, because once this is approved in 2010 or 12,
 16   you know, some of us will still be here and we'll
 17   have to be dealing with traffic then.  We just want
 18   to make sure we make the right decision.
 19                  MR. MAGRINI:  We will still own this.
 20   I mean, to be honest, all these office buildings and
 21   hotels, we fight every day to put tenants in them,
 22   and I'm going to tell you, one of the big issues is
 23   traffic, there's no question about it, and again,
 24   that's why I don't want to go on, you have other
 25   people here tonight, but that's why we're putting our
00042
  1   own traffic signal in, to make sure the pedestrian
  2   walk -- we're not a redundant bike way, walkway, to
  3   make sure it does work, you know, friendly to
  4   everybody, pedestrians, bikes, vehicles.  Again, we
  5   don't disagree.  We don't disagree one bit.  When we
  6   built this, again, the engineer said, you know, 19th
  7   Street is a big, wide street.  We spent the money and
  8   we did that, no cost.  There's no government
  9   subsidies in there, no nothing, so we're ready to do
 10   it.
 11                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  So you're saying
 12   if --
 13                  MR. MAGRINI:  I'll tell you what, I
 14   will agree to commit that piece of land, and if we
 15   have a problem, we'll have to come back, but I'll
 16   agree to the request that the town -- that we
 17   dedicate a 10-foot strip by 200 feet, so, in length
 18   there.
 19                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Mr. Chairman,
 20   that's satisfactory, if we can agree on the language
 21   which cannot be later on twisted around, because it
 22   was my concern to get a piece of, piece of that
 23   property to widen the road, and the county's willing
 24   to get state money to do this work, physically widen
 25   it, redo the traffic light and all this.
00043
  1                  MR. MAGRINI:  We'll agree to dedicate
  2   that piece of land.
  3                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Any other
  4   questions from the Board?
  5           Put a motion out to approve with making sure
  6   that we get the property that we need.
  7                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  Mr. Jasek's
  8   got to come up with the introduction, what he wants.
  9           What does he want?
 10                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  You have the
 11   wording you want to put in?
 12                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  The condition
 13   would be that the applicant will dedicate a strip of
 14   the land starting from 19th Street along the easterly
 15   side of the Kennedy Boulevard East going north for
 16   the length of 250 feet.
 17                  MR. MAGRINI:  We agree.
 18                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Okay?  Satisfied,
 19   Commissioner?
 20           Can I have a motion to approve?
 21                  COMMISSIONER CHOFFO:  I'll make a
 22   motion based on Commissioner Jasek's recommendation.
 23                  COMMISSIONER BETTINGER:  I'll second
 24   that motion.
 25                  MR. MARKS:  Mr. Chairman, on a motion
00044
  1   to approve SP/SD-81-05 made by Commissioner Choffo
  2   and seconded by Commissioner Bettinger:
  3           Commissioner Avagliano?
  4                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  With all due
  5   concern, I'd like to see everyone get-together on
  6   this application, and I'll go along with Mr. Jasek
  7   and hope that all his recommendations are requested
  8   and obtained, I vote aye.
  9                  MR. MARKS:  Commissioner Jasek?
 10                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  I vote aye.
 11                  MR. MARKS:  Commissioner Mehta?
 12                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  Aye.
 13                  MR. MARKS:  Chairman Holloway?
 14                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Aye, with the
 15   condition that Mr. Jasek voted.
 16                  MR. MAGRINI:  Thank you, very much.
 17   Good evening.
 18                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Thank you.
 19                  MR. MARKS:  Mr. Chairman --
 20                  MR. SEAMAN:  That will be marked as
 21   what?  All right.  The Pedestrian Circulation Plan
 22   dated 6-7-05, it will be marked as Exhibit-A.  We're
 23   going to get another copy of this which will be
 24   forwarded to Mr. Marks.
 25                  MR. MAGRINI:  Good night.  Thanks.
00045
  1                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Thank you, very
  2   much.
  3                  MR. MARKS:  Mr. Chairman, next item on
  4   the Agenda is SP-83-05, Michael P. Gorman, located at
  5   451-457 14th Street, Hoboken, New Jersey.
  6           Mr. Chairman, the applicant was notified of
  7   this evening's proceedings.  It doesn't appear that
  8   the applicant --
  9                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  There are some
 10   gentlemen outside, at the table out there.
 11                  MR. MARKS:  I'll go check.
 12                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Thank you.
 13                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  Are they from
 14   Hoboken?
 15                  MR. MARKS:  No.
 16                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  I didn't
 17   think so.
 18                  MR. MARKS:  Mr. Chairman, it doesn't
 19   appear that the applicant is present.
 20                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Okay.
 21                  MR. MARKS:  Motion to table or --
 22                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Yes.
 23           Can I have a motion to table this to next
 24   month?
 25                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  All right.
00046
  1   Motion to table the application from Hoboken.
  2                  COMMISSIONER BETTINGER:  I'll second
  3   the motion.
  4                  MR. MARKS:  Mr. Chairman, on a motion
  5   to table SP-83-05 made by Commissioner Avagliano and
  6   seconded by Commissioner Bettinger:
  7           Commissioner Choffo?
  8                  COMMISSIONER CHOFFO:  Aye.
  9                  MR. MARKS:  Commissioner Jasek?
 10                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Aye.
 11                  MR. MARKS:  Commissioner Mehta?
 12                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  Aye.
 13                  MR. MARKS:  Chairman Holloway?
 14                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Aye.
 15                  MR. MARKS:  Mr. Chairman, the motion
 16   is tabled, or the application was tabled.
 17                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Thank you.
 18                  MR. MARKS:  Mr. Chairman, next
 19   application scheduled for public hearing is SP-85-05,
 20   Nu Dimension Construction Enterprise, located at
 21   7908-7914 Kennedy Boulevard in North Bergen.
 22                  MR. R. HUBSCHMAN:  Good evening, Mr.
 23   Chairman.
 24                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Good evening.
 25                  MR. R. HUBSCHMAN:  Richard Hubschman,
00047
  1   appearing on behalf of the applicant.
  2           This is an application that's been submitted
  3   to the Board concerning the property located at
  4   7908-7914 Kennedy Boulevard in North Bergen for the
  5   proposed construction of 12 residential dwelling
  6   units on the property.  Application has been
  7   submitted to you previously by letter of August 12th.
  8           Present is our engineer, Michael Hubschman,
  9   prepared to speak to the Board, unless there's any
 10   questions of me.
 11                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Can you swear him
 12   in, please?
 13                  MR. SEAMAN:  Yes.
 14                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  He's going to
 15   swear you in, please.
 16   MICHAEL J. HUBSCHMAN, P.E., P.P., having been first
 17   duly sworn according to law, testified as follows:
 18                  MR. SEAMAN:  State your name.
 19                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  Michael Hubschman.
 20   I'm a Licensed Professional Engineer and Planner in
 21   the State of New Jersey.
 22                  MR. SEAMAN:  Thank you.
 23                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Thank you.
 24                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  Thank you.
 25                  MR. R. HUBSCHMAN:  Chairman, is there
00048
  1   a need to qualify him?
  2                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Please, would you,
  3   on the record?
  4                  MR. R. HUBSCHMAN:  Mike, would you
  5   state your education, work experience and licenses
  6   held, please?
  7                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  Yes.  I'm a
  8   graduate of NJIT in 1979, Licensed Engineer since
  9   1984.  I have been licensed for 21 years and I own
 10   Hubschman Engineering, which we specialize in site
 11   plans and subdivision, and I have been, you know,
 12   performing this type of work for over 20 years in
 13   this area and Bergen County.  This is about as far
 14   south as we go, North Bergen and up into Bergen
 15   County.
 16                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  We welcome you.
 17                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  Thank you.
 18                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Thank you.
 19                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  Okay.  This is a
 20   fairly small project.  It's a 70 foot by 103 foot
 21   property located on the easterly side of Kennedy
 22   Boulevard.  It's a level property, generally level.
 23   There's presently two families on the property.
 24   They're proposing to remove the two two families and
 25   construct a building that has 12 one bedroom
00049
  1   apartments.  The parking is all at-grade under the
  2   building, and then there are three residential
  3   stories above that.  Each story has four apartments.
  4   We're proposing a 20 -- 23 spaces are provided under,
  5   and we designed it in accordance with the RSIS
  6   Standards, the Residential Site Improvement Standards
  7   of New Jersey.
  8                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  When you say
  9   under, do you mean below ground or you mean level?
 10                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  No.  They're
 11   at-grade, right under.  The building is three
 12   stories.  It's a four-story building, including the
 13   parking at-grade.
 14           The drainage is also designed in accordance
 15   with the RSIS Standards.  We're proposing a pipe
 16   storage system that's under the building, so we meet
 17   the percent deductions that are required now by the
 18   State of New Jersey, and then that ties in.  There's
 19   an existing sanitary sewer and drainage, separate
 20   sewers on our side of Kennedy Boulevard.  We're
 21   proposing all duct liner pipe in the road, and the
 22   other, it's, you know, generally, you know, one
 23   entrance, exit.  It's a simple -- you know, it's a
 24   small, small plan.  New curbs and sidewalks along the
 25   front, as required.  It was recently redone, but
00050
  1   we're -- we have to remove some curb-cuts and so
  2   forth and, you know, probably end up redoing the
  3   entire frontage.
  4                  MR. R. HUBSCHMAN:  Excuse me, Mike.
  5   For purposes of clarification, the units are
  6   designated on these architectural plans which were
  7   submitted --
  8                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  Yes.
  9                  MR. R. HUBSCHMAN: -- I believe two
 10   bedrooms.
 11                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  Well, they're one.
 12   Okay?
 13                  MR. R. HUBSCHMAN:  Just clarify the
 14   numbers.
 15                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  Okay.  Well, yeah,
 16   the architect's plan shows it's one bedroom and then
 17   there's a second den/bedroom, so there are, I think
 18   they're really more flexible.
 19                  MR. R. HUBSCHMAN:  And your parking
 20   calculations are based on the two bedroom
 21   calculation?
 22                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  No.  On the one
 23   bedroom.
 24                  MR. R. HUBSCHMAN:  Okay.
 25                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  Yeah.
00051
  1                  MR. R. HUBSCHMAN:  So how many parking
  2   spaces did you provide on site?
  3                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  We're providing 23
  4   spaces on site.
  5                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Is there any
  6   handicapped?
  7                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  There's one
  8   handicapped space proposed.  The building has the
  9   stairwell and there's an elevator approximately in
 10   the center underneath the -- would be on the
 11   southerly center wall there's an elevator and the
 12   handicapped space is located right in front of that.
 13                  MR. R. HUBSCHMAN:  We're also
 14   proposing to move the existing traffic light.  Did he
 15   explain that?
 16           Can you explain that to them?
 17                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  There's an existing
 18   traffic pole that we're going to have to relocate,
 19   and our traffic engineer is working on that plan
 20   right now, to relocate that light.  We're at that
 21   Kennedy Boulevard and 80th Street intersection and
 22   our exit would then be signalized with that
 23   intersection.
 24                  MR. R. HUBSCHMAN:  And we're pending
 25   before the Department of Transportation; is that
00052
  1   correct?
  2                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  Well, we're
  3   preparing the plans and then we have to, I
  4   understand, get the endorsement of the county and
  5   then go to the DOT, is the process, so --
  6                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  You would have to
  7   get approval from DOT to approve a light, right?
  8                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  Yes.  We have to
  9   get their, their approval, yes, to move it.
 10                  COMMISSIONER CHOFFO:  One question.
 11                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  We're really not
 12   moving the light.  We're moving the pole, actually.
 13   The light, the light is on an arm, so we're actually
 14   moving the base, because it's in our driveway.
 15                  COMMISSIONER CHOFFO:  What street is
 16   that, to the north?
 17                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  This is 80th
 18   Street, also, the one way.
 19                  COMMISSIONER CHOFFO:  To the south?
 20                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  And that's 79th.
 21                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  What is on
 22   that property right now?
 23                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  On this property
 24   are two two families.
 25                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  And you're
00053
  1   going to make three out of it?
  2                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  We're going to make
  3   one apartment building of 12 units.
  4                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Wait until you
  5   finish -- are you finished with your questions?
  6                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  That's really it.
  7   Pretty simple, you know, flat lot, simple project.
  8                  MR. R. HUBSCHMAN:  Sufficient number
  9   of parking provided?
 10                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  Yes.
 11                  MR. R. HUBSCHMAN:  And you provided a
 12   set of --
 13                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  Yes.  That's under
 14   it.  There's a refuge room.
 15                  MR. R. HUBSCHMAN:  Any access you
 16   designed for the property is going to be sufficient
 17   to get in and out, to provide for safe entry and
 18   exit?
 19                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  Yes.  There would
 20   be a garage door in front and, you know, typical
 21   aisle width, you know, there's a 25, we have a 25
 22   foot -- 24 foot aisle width, 18 foot space, so it's
 23   all standard, standard size spaces and aisle ways.
 24                  MR. R. HUBSCHMAN:  And the project was
 25   designed, Mr. Chairman, Members of the Board, so that
00054
  1   it had a significantly complete residential look from
  2   the front, and the parking is, in fact, shielded from
  3   the street, so there would be no parking visible.
  4   There's a wall type with landscaping proposed across
  5   the front, which was at the suggestion of North
  6   Bergen.  Our application's going to be filed within
  7   the next couple days, and it's been completed.
  8                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Mr. Jasek, do you
  9   have any questions?
 10                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Mr. Chairman, I
 11   was going to ask you, the parking closed or open?
 12   It's closed from the street?
 13                  MR. R. HUBSCHMAN:  Yes, sir.
 14                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  On that side way,
 15   is the staircase -- it's open on the other side?
 16                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  The staircase is --
 17   well, there's two staircases.  They both come out --
 18   they're open from the inside and they, they're
 19   emergency exit doors that come out to that walk on
 20   the south side, so there are two, two staircases.
 21                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Concerning the
 22   traffic light, have your engineer contact my office
 23   as soon as possible, because DOT will not deal with
 24   this project until, as you said, county endorses it.
 25                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  Right.
00055
  1                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  We can supply the
  2   existing plan for the traffic light, which will be
  3   very helpful, but it is an approved traffic signal.
  4                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  Okay.  Yes.  I'll
  5   have --
  6                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Any modification
  7   needs to go through the process of more than this
  8   approval, so it will end up as an approved signal
  9   again.
 10                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  Yes.
 11                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  You will need to
 12   secure all the contracts.  You need to secure the
 13   road opening permits.  You mentioned that utilities
 14   are on your side of the road.  I don't know if you
 15   are -- and, of course, if you are changing the
 16   driveways, you will have to change the curb.
 17                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  Yes.  Yes.  The
 18   gas, telephone and water are, are on the sidewalk,
 19   but the sanitary and drain are right in the, you
 20   know, a few feet into the traveled way.
 21                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  When this project
 22   will go into construction?
 23                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  I would say about
 24   six months, by the time we get all, the rest of the
 25   approvals and --
00056
  1                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  The county has a
  2   project for the next year, late next year, repaving
  3   that portion of the Boulevard, so it would be
  4   advantageous if you are done with the road opening
  5   cuts.
  6                  MR. R. HUBSCHMAN:  We'll make a note
  7   of that, sir.
  8                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  Sorry.
  9                  MR. R. HUBSCHMAN:  We'll make a note
 10   of that.
 11                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  Yes.  No.  We
 12   should be starting, I would say by the time we get
 13   the approvals, it would be December-ish or January,
 14   so probably start, you know, in the spring or early
 15   spring.
 16                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Mr. Jasek, I'd
 17   like to ask you a question.
 18           Based on the number of parking underneath
 19   that building, is one handicapped sufficient?
 20                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Yes.
 21                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Okay.  Any other
 22   Commissioners have any questions?
 23                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  Do they have the
 24   local approval?
 25                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Do you have the
00057
  1   local approval yet?
  2                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  I'm sorry.
  3                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Do you have local
  4   approval yet?
  5                  MR. M. HUBSCHMAN:  No.  Not yet.  We
  6   just got the letter of denial.  We're going in
  7   October before the Board.
  8                  MR. R. HUBSCHMAN:  We plan to be on
  9   the Board --
 10                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  What Board are
 11   you planning to go to?
 12                  MR. R. HUBSCHMAN:  Board of
 13   Adjustment, sir.
 14                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  And these are 12
 15   one bedroom apartments or it's --
 16                  MR. R. HUBSCHMAN:  Well, it's 12 one
 17   bedroom with the, you know, studio type of room in
 18   there.  A lot of the one bedrooms now put a smaller
 19   room in which doubles as an office or a study type of
 20   facility there, so --
 21                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Any more
 22   questions?
 23           Motion to approve?  Motion to approve, as
 24   long as they get the okay from North Bergen, can I
 25   have a motion?
00058
  1                  COMMISSIONER BETTINGER:  I'll make a
  2   motion.
  3                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  I second.
  4                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  I second the
  5   motion, provided you go to North Bergen, and when
  6   they approve it, we'll approve it.  If there are any
  7   questions, then you'll have to come back before us.
  8                  MR. R. HUBSCHMAN:  Yes, ma'am.
  9                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  Thank you.
 10                  MR. MARKS:  Mr. Chairman, on a motion
 11   made by Commissioner Bettinger and seconded by
 12   Commissioner Avagliano:
 13           Commissioner Choffo?
 14                  COMMISSIONER CHOFFO:  I vote aye.
 15                  MR. MARKS:  Commissioner Jasek?
 16                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Aye.
 17                  MR. MARKS:  Commissioner Mehta?
 18                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  I vote aye,
 19   subject to the local approval.  If they need
 20   modification, you are to come in front of us again.
 21                  MR. MARKS:  Chairman Holloway?
 22                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Aye.
 23                  MR. MARKS:  Mr. Chairman, the motion
 24   passed.
 25                  MR. R. HUBSCHMAN:  Thanks, very much.
00059
  1                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Thank you.
  2                  MR. MARKS:  Mr. Chairman, the next
  3   matter scheduled for public hearing is application
  4   SP-91-05, Stephen McCormick, located at 111-115 Frank
  5   E. Rodgers Boulevard in Harrison.
  6                  MR. McCORMICK:  Yes.  I'm the owner of
  7   the property located at 111 --
  8                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Speak into the
  9   mike.
 10                  MR. McCORMICK:  I'm the owner of the
 11   property in question, 111-115 Rodgers Boulevard in
 12   Harrison.  That's an existing building which has 75
 13   foot --
 14                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Hold on.
 15                  MR. SEAMAN:  Sir, we'd like to have
 16   you sworn in, please.
 17   STEPHEN McCORMICK, having been first duly sworn
 18   according to law, testified as follows:
 19                  MR. SEAMAN:  State your name.
 20                  MR. McCORMICK:  Steve McCormick.
 21                  MR. SEAMAN:  Okay.
 22                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Thank you.
 23                  MR. McCORMICK:  Should I start from
 24   the beginning?
 25                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  If you could.
00060
  1                  MR. McCORMICK:  Okay.  I'm here on
  2   behalf -- I'm the owner of the building.  It's
  3   located at 111-115 Frank Rodgers Boulevard South in
  4   Harrison, New Jersey.  This is an existing building
  5   which has 75 foot frontage on Frank Rodgers
  6   Boulevard, which is a county road.  I've already gone
  7   through a variance process with the Town of Harrison
  8   and I'm here, they recommended that I get approval
  9   from the county, if it's necessary.  It's kind of a
 10   gray area, to have awnings placed on the front of my
 11   building.  The awnings are actually existing now, but
 12   we're going to be doing new facade work to the front
 13   and the side of the building and they recommended
 14   that I bring it to your attention.  These awnings
 15   will be attached to the building only.  They'll be
 16   nothing anchored in the sidewalk, and I have brought
 17   pictures and architectural drawings of where they'll
 18   be applied to the building.
 19                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Commissioner
 20   Jasek, do you have any concerns?
 21                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Mr. Chairman,
 22   this is a temporary structure only, so I don't have
 23   any problem with that.  I would assume that the
 24   applicant doesn't need any permit from my office
 25   because it's not touching the sidewalk or, therefore,
00061
  1   the roadway.
  2                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Any other
  3   Commissioners have any questions concerning this?
  4                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  Were they --
  5                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  It's a rare
  6   situation, I understand that.
  7                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  Were they
  8   approved by Harrison?
  9                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Were you approved
 10   by Harrison yet?
 11                  MR. McCORMICK:  Yes.
 12                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  Oh, you
 13   were?
 14                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Can I get a motion
 15   to approve this application?
 16                  COMMISSIONER CHOFFO:  I'll make a
 17   motion.
 18                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  I will second it.
 19                  MR. MARKS:  Mr. Chairman, on a motion
 20   made by Commissioner Choffo and seconded by
 21   Commissioner Mehta:
 22           Commissioner Avagliano?
 23                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  I vote aye,
 24   as long as it was approved by the Harrison Board.
 25           Thank you.
00062
  1                  MR. MARKS:  Commissioner Bettinger?
  2                  COMMISSIONER BETTINGER:  It's going to
  3   be an improvement for the area.  I vote aye.
  4                  MR. MARKS:  Commissioner Jasek?
  5                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Aye.
  6                  MR. MARKS:  Chairman Holloway?
  7                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Aye.
  8                  MR. MARKS:  Mr. Chairman, the motion
  9   passed.
 10                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Thank you.
 11                  MR. McCORMICK:  Thank you, very much.
 12   I appreciate it.
 13                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Any old business?
 14                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Mr. Chairman, I
 15   have one, one item which I, I read very carefully the
 16   minutes from the last meeting because I was not here
 17   and --
 18                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  And we missed
 19   you.
 20                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  I missed you,
 21   too, and there was an application, SP-37, 37-05,
 22   which was tabled last time and moved to this meeting
 23   and I don't see that on the Agenda.
 24                  MR. MARKS:  Mr. Chairman, that, that
 25   application was discussed at the July or the August
00063
  1   Pre Agenda Meeting.  It was supposed to have been
  2   referred to the consulting engineers.  It was
  3   mistakenly put on the Agenda, so when it was tabled,
  4   we, in fact, forwarded it to the consulting engineers
  5   for, specifically with regard to drainage.  It was a
  6   very dense residential development on Manhattan
  7   Avenue in Union City.  The County Engineer and the
  8   Pre Agenda Site Plan, Subdivision Review Committee
  9   had concerns about the drainage pits that were to be
 10   bored into the Palisades and it was referred to the
 11   consulting engineers for particular attention to be
 12   paid to the drainage calculation.
 13                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  So we will see
 14   that in the near future when we get all the reports.
 15   Very good.  Thank you.
 16                  MR. MARKS:  That will be, the
 17   engineer's report will be available for the meeting
 18   in October.
 19                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Thanks.
 20                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Anything else?
 21                  MR. MARKS:  Mr. Chairman, in your
 22   packages this evening -- just a couple matters.  At
 23   the previous meeting Commissioner Avagliano had
 24   mentioned a possible workshop to be sponsored by or
 25   given by attorney Glen Keith.  How do you pronounce
00064
  1   that, I'm sorry, Glen Keiths?  Commissioner
  2   Avagliano?
  3                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  Excuse me.
  4                  MR. MARKS:  Glen Keiths, is it?
  5                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  Glen Keiths.
  6   We all know Glen.  He has been before this Board.
  7                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  No.  No.  I don't
  8   know Glen.  I don't know Glen.
  9                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  You don't
 10   know who you're missing.
 11                  MR. MARKS:  Our attorney, Mr.
 12   Calvanico, did reach out to Mr. Keiths who was
 13   amenable to it and it's just a matter -- included in
 14   your packet is a copy of the e-mail with the
 15   information attached to it.  A recently passed law,
 16   PL 2005, Chapter 133, Chapter 133 was approved on
 17   July 7, 2005.  It is specifically related to
 18   Municipal Planning Boards, but it would be helpful,
 19   especially for the County Board, County Planning
 20   Board to be included or follow the, follow the wishes
 21   of the law, rather than the letter of the law, and to
 22   basically hone your skills as Commissioners and get
 23   additional information.
 24           That's one thing, and it's just a matter of
 25   finding a mutually convenient time for the Board to
00065
  1   have Mr. Keiths.
  2                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  I'm sorry.  Is
  3   this going to cost the Board any funds?
  4                  MR. MARKS:  We'll discuss that with
  5   Mr. Calvanico and see what, what would be a
  6   reasonable sum.
  7                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  What, the
  8   training session?
  9                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Yes.
 10                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  No, it
 11   doesn't.  It's going to cost -- the Board will pay
 12   for it.
 13                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  I just wanted to
 14   know how much.  Don't speculate.
 15                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  No.  No.  He
 16   gives you a class rate.  Depends on how many go, then
 17   he'll give you a class rate.
 18                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Let's find out
 19   what -- I think it's a good idea.  I just want to
 20   know.
 21                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  Class rate is
 22   cheaper.
 23                  MR. MARKS:  Okay.  Next item, Mr.
 24   Chairman, the New Jersey Association of -- New Jersey
 25   Chapter of the American Planning Association has an
00066
  1   annual conference.  This year it's Friday, October
  2   28th, down at the Hyatt Regency in New Brunswick.
  3   Included in your packages is a complete conference
  4   schedule of workshops around table discussions.  The
  5   last page is the mail-in registration.  If anybody,
  6   if any of the Commissioners are interested and
  7   available, I think it's a worthwhile conference, and
  8   if you're interested, please fill it out, forward it
  9   to me and I'll register any Commissioner who is
 10   interested and available for the NJAPA conference.
 11           The final part of your packets this evening
 12   is correspondence and a letter from the Sands.  It
 13   was requested -- I told the Board back in June, the
 14   League of Municipalities makes rooms available
 15   beginning June 1st, reservations, June 1st, which is
 16   the first day that the reservations became
 17   available.  I called to register each and every Board
 18   Member for the League of Municipalities conference
 19   and the hotel registrations.  It was, I think the
 20   consensus of the Board, that they wanted to stay at
 21   Bally's.  That was the number one list.
 22   Unfortunately, or I shouldn't say unfortunately,
 23   despite your wishes, the only registration that we
 24   did receive back was for the Sands.  If any
 25   Commissioner has a problem, a particular problem with
00067
  1   the Sands or doesn't wish to go to the conference or
  2   wishes to stay at another hotel, you do have the
  3   conference -- the hotel reservation information also
  4   attached with the confirmation numbers, and feel free
  5   to call to either cancel or change your
  6   accommodations accordingly.
  7           That's all I have, Mr. Chairman.
  8                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  I do want to
  9   inform the Board, and maybe, Steve, you can go into a
 10   little more detail.  We're getting ready to have a
 11   meeting with the Improvement Authority on two
 12   subjects, and hopefully we'll get interlocal
 13   agreement with them.  Maybe explain a little detail
 14   on both of them, do the enforcement, looking at the
 15   applicants and making sure that they follow through
 16   on their end of the bargain, and the other one is to
 17   straighten out our funds that we have in the account.
 18                  MR. MARKS:  Sure.
 19           We had discussed previously at prior planning
 20   board meetings the state of the escrow account.  The
 21   HCIA does have on retainer a licensed professional
 22   CPA firm.  Instead of re-inventing the wheel, the
 23   HCIA has expressed satisfaction with their services
 24   and would be helpful for that, maybe you, Mr.
 25   Chairman, would have the name of the firm, but I
00068
  1   can't recall off the top of my head, but the firm
  2   could take a look at the state of the escrow accounts
  3   and -- basically, we have escrow deposits going back
  4   years which need to be cleaned up, and whatever
  5   unused funds are left, we have to get returned to the
  6   actual applicants.
  7           In addition, besides that point, the County
  8   Engineer's Office has inspectors available for
  9   different inspection projects, and Lou Damico has
 10   been wonderful in identifying property owners and
 11   developers or who are not living up to their
 12   applications or who are doing things out in the
 13   street on the Boulevard which they shouldn't be
 14   doing, which they don't have authorization to do or
 15   approval to do.  A partnership with the Improvement
 16   Authority would give this Board additional resources
 17   besides Mr. Damico with the Engineer's Office to
 18   actually have enforcement officers at our disposal,
 19   if it's necessary, and also, a lot of -- it coincides
 20   with the HCIA's admission, because a lot of
 21   development applications involve construction and
 22   demolition debris and other, other matters which are
 23   before the Improvement Authority, so it would be,
 24   essentially, killing birds with one stone.
 25                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Okay.  After the
00069
  1   meeting, we'll address it further.  See what
  2   happens.  I just want to inform the Board that we are
  3   doing that.
  4                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  Is there any
  5   reason that -- last time we discussed about escrow
  6   money, that it will, we will go with bidding process
  7   and figure it out, the process, and instead of the
  8   bidding process, we are selecting one CPA firm.  Is
  9   there any particular reason?
 10                  MR. MARKS:  It's really up to the
 11   Board.  I didn't have the resources or the
 12   wherewithal to move ahead on that, and the Chairman
 13   and I have been discussing, the Chairman has been
 14   using -- not to repeat, Mr. Chairman, but the
 15   Chairman has been using some of the resources of the
 16   Improvement Authority for taking pictures and
 17   actually inspecting some of the sites that are before
 18   this Board, and it was just an outgrowth of one of
 19   those conversations, so it's really up to the
 20   Chairman and the Board, what to do about the escrow
 21   accounts, and the, the accounting firm, whether that
 22   should be included in the local agreement with the
 23   Improvement Authority or out, you know, outside of
 24   that agreement.
 25                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  It's just
00070
  1   something we'll look into.  It's not something that
  2   we'll actually do.  I just wanted to give another way
  3   of doing things to the Board.
  4           The other part about the enforcement, the
  5   Improvement Authority has officers throughout the
  6   county, they have been extremely locked out, and so
  7   we can let these applicants know that we may be
  8   looking at the applicant after, even during the
  9   construction, so they see exactly what we said they
 10   will do and not bear off it.
 11                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  Excuse me.
 12                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  But isn't it that
 13   application, because when they were -- we approve any
 14   project, it is also always subject to the local
 15   approval, and when the local approval, then they go
 16   to the local Zoning Board and local, even the
 17   Building Code Official, they always emphasize that
 18   they --
 19                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  But do we
 20   guarantee what we ask them to do is done?  Several
 21   times we asked them for a stipulation on here and
 22   then we find out it hasn't been done.
 23                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  Mr. Chairman, the
 24   Building Official or Building Inspector, which will
 25   make all the comments, but he will not inspect the
00071
  1   road opening.
  2                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Exactly.
  3                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  They don't care
  4   about it.  It's county business and it's our problem.
  5                  MR. MARKS:  Mr. Chairman, just to
  6   reiterate that point, one of the applications that
  7   was before the Board this evening, the Hartz
  8   Mountain, it was the township's concern about Baldwin
  9   Avenue, and they really, through pressing the county
 10   to make improvements to 19th Street, which is
 11   adjacent to the development of the property, but it
 12   really wasn't -- I guess it didn't occur to the
 13   township, Weehawken Township Officials that 19th
 14   Street and Boulevard East was a major ingress and
 15   egress for the Lincoln Harbor Development.  It's one
 16   of those things.  There's two other instances which
 17   actually were before the Board in the last year.  One
 18   was Wallmart in Kearny.  Mr. Jasek, the County
 19   Engineer, I'm sure, is extremely familiar with the
 20   situation, whereby the Board granted approval to
 21   Wallmart and the applicant working with the town
 22   started construction on Harrison Avenue without
 23   obtaining road, proper road opening permits, and we
 24   had a situation where utility poles were not moved
 25   and were in the middle of a roadway as the, the town
00072
  1   and the applicant were doing their construction.  At
  2   least that was, you know, it was a major problem.
  3   They didn't -- after the fact, they just wanted to
  4   get the project approved and done and they didn't
  5   seek consultation with the County Engineer's Office.
  6   A third matter, which I pass almost every day, is
  7   Applebee's in Kearny.  Mr. Calisto Bertin, who is the
  8   consulting engineer for Applebee's in Kearny,
  9   promised that they were going to close the driveway
 10   on Passaic Avenue in Kearny by Bergen Avenue, and I
 11   pass there every day and the driveway that they said
 12   they were going to close is still open.  They've just
 13   redone the entrance, the curbs for that.  That
 14   application, where they should have closed the
 15   driveway, and the driveway, the, the northerly
 16   driveway which they were supposed to make
 17   improvements to, improve the ingress and egress from
 18   Bergen Avenue, they haven't touched, which is exactly
 19   counter to the record and the comments of the County
 20   Engineer, going back to, I believe January of this
 21   year, so it's, it's not always -- the town's
 22   interests are not always the county's interest.  I
 23   don't think the Improvement Authority or the County
 24   Inspectors would be concerned about the insides of
 25   the buildings, but definitely with regard to the road
00073
  1   opening permits and the, the driveways.  We have
  2   authority, we have jurisdiction, and we have an
  3   interest.
  4                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  Because I think a
  5   couple of months ago we discuss the same issue, that
  6   it looks like the town is trying to pass the -- but
  7   at the same time, when we are passing any resolution,
  8   we are definitely helping from the town, also, and I
  9   think if we can have a better communication with the
 10   Town Official and Planning Board on the way they
 11   will -- on this type of, this type of dispute or
 12   major concern, it will be better for the entire
 13   county.
 14                  MR. MARKS:  Mr. Chairman, I totally
 15   agree.
 16                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  I agree.  This is
 17   the reason why I'm saying, if the town can actually
 18   do that and be concerned what the county is concerned
 19   about, I have no problem with that.  I don't know how
 20   many municipalities can worry about what the county
 21   issues are.
 22                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  I am aware of
 23   North Bergen area, and the North Bergen, even the
 24   Zoning Officer in the district, and they are always
 25   emphasizing on the roads and the permit and all, and
00074
  1   they stop the, even construction.
  2                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Commissioner, are
  3   they concerned about what the county's concerns are?
  4                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  Yes.
  5                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  You're aware of
  6   it, North Bergen?
  7                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  Usually they
  8   cooperate.
  9                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  No.  Not usually.
 10   Are they?  That's what my concern is.
 11           These applicants come here, they agree to
 12   something, they don't follow through and we don't
 13   know that.  As soon as something happens, that's when
 14   we find out, so I was only trying to make it easier
 15   for the Board.
 16                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  I understand, but
 17   that's why last time it was suggested, and I will
 18   suggest one thing, that if we can have one type of --
 19   one day or even one meeting with the, each and every
 20   Town Official, as well as the County Official, on the
 21   common knowledge.
 22                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Commissioner, I
 23   have no problem looking into that.
 24                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  Then we can
 25   understand their concern, as well as they can
00075
  1   understand our concern, and the -- sometimes you say,
  2   like, jurisdiction problem, also that, even the,
  3   whether the county has jurisdiction or whether the
  4   town has the jurisdiction, because you can say,
  5   according to the bylaws of the Planning Board, we
  6   have a very, very limited jurisdiction on any
  7   application.
  8                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Commissioner
  9   Mehta, you know that City Officials have no
 10   jurisdiction concerning the county property; am I
 11   correct?
 12                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  I understand, but
 13   that's why --
 14                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  If all they're
 15   worried about is what the municipalities are worried
 16   about, insides and construction, our concerns are
 17   different.  Traffic.
 18                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  I understand, but
 19   that's my --
 20                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Sewage.
 21                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  That's my only
 22   point.  I'm only suggesting the same thing, if we can
 23   have one day, like, seminar, meeting where --
 24                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  Conference.
 25                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA: -- so the 12 or 13
00076
  1   towns or planning or Zoning Official, as well as our,
  2   even the Engineer, Bob Jasek, and, like, our Board
  3   Members can have a sit-down meeting and we can
  4   have -- straighten out our differences among
  5   ourselves, and then we can say that, okay, the town
  6   has this jurisdiction and town is concerned about
  7   this one and county is concerned about this
  8   jurisdiction and county will have this problem, so we
  9   will know their problem as well as they are aware
 10   about our issues and our problem, also.
 11                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Commissioner, I
 12   have no problem -- if we can get all 12
 13   municipalities to agree to work with us, I have no
 14   problem with that.
 15                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  At least we can
 16   try.
 17                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  We can try.
 18                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  We can have a
 19   seminar.
 20                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  We'll tackle this
 21   further down the road.
 22                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  But at least, I
 23   think League of Municipalities coming is 99 percent,
 24   mostly everybody might be going, we can set up one
 25   meeting possibly then.
00077
  1                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  But the most
  2   serious concern right now is that the county needs to
  3   be addressed, so I'll get information from the
  4   Improvement Authority, see if it's even cheaper to do
  5   it that way than putting out an RFP and we'll come
  6   back to the Board and vote.
  7                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  Question.
  8   Doesn't county have inspectors that can go out and
  9   check what foundations are put in to be done
 10   properly?
 11                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  The reason I say
 12   it, I'm not speaking out of turn, the manpower.
 13                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  County concern is
 14   the foundation.  You read the article in Bayonne
 15   where they have to put the foundation -- it's
 16   strictly municipal business, municipal construction
 17   inspectors.  What our inspectors are doing, checking
 18   out that road openings are properly filled so they
 19   don't sink two weeks later, that the sidewalk is
 20   properly repaired after they run the pipes, but it's
 21   county business, and we find infraction, we call the
 22   sheriff, sheriff writes the summons, we have to go to
 23   the municipal court.  It's a very cumbersome process.
 24                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  I went to see
 25   that problem in Bayonne where the lot was sold.  It
00078
  1   was a gas station and they built three houses, and
  2   you stood in front of those bricks, you would have
  3   seen that they're all crooked, every one of them, and
  4   they're all broken.  That's the fault of the
  5   inspectors in the city.
  6                  COMMISSIONER JASEK:  That's correct.
  7                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  You're making my
  8   point.
  9                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  You got to
 10   have --
 11                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  This is what I'm
 12   saying.  This Board is set up for a reason.  I'm not
 13   saying all applicants, but a lot of applicants feel
 14   that the county is a rubber stamp and they don't
 15   really have to do anything but face us, tell us their
 16   story and leave, and that's not right.  There's
 17   issues they have to follow, so if it has something to
 18   do with the traffic, sewage recommendation, some
 19   people don't even follow through on that.  I'm not an
 20   engineer.  I can't go through and see if they did
 21   it.  That's why we have Mr. Jasek and his staff.  He
 22   doesn't have enough staff to do that.  They got to
 23   take this Board seriously or I don't know why we're
 24   sitting here.
 25                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  Well, someone
00079
  1   should call maybe Glen Keiths and ask him if he
  2   could --
  3                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  But I have no
  4   problem getting all the municipalities together.
  5                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  In Atlantic
  6   City we can have a seminar and Glen Keiths could
  7   teach us what to do about that and bring the people
  8   and the inspectors from the city and the county.
  9                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  We can do that.  I
 10   have no problem.  I'm sure the Board would have no
 11   problem.
 12                  COMMISSIONER AVAGLIANO:  Rushabh made
 13   a good point, though.  In fact, on the application
 14   for the hotel, it says room being shared with.  He
 15   made such a good point, I'm sharing it with Rushabh.
 16                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  You sure you're
 17   going to set this up?
 18                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA:  Gentlemen, don't
 19   take me wrong.  My point, I was trying to make a
 20   point.  I think we mix up the two issues.  I was
 21   concerned about this escrow account and funding as
 22   well as this engineering contract.  You can say we
 23   discussed in the past that we are going to do, give
 24   out this contract on the business of the bidding
 25   process and whether we are doing that process or
00080
  1   not.  My issue was that --
  2                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  I understand.
  3                  COMMISSIONER MEHTA: -- concerning,
  4   regarding Hudson County Improvement Authority doing
  5   the leg work and even the follow-up, with our
  6   permission, and definitely, I appreciate that.  I
  7   think it gives more power to the, our Board as well
  8   as, even the people will take more seriously to our
  9   Board.  Definitely, I am for it, but my question was
 10   regarding -- to the accounting firm as well as the
 11   engineering contract.
 12                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  I understand.
 13                  COMMISSIONER BETTINGER:  Mr. Chairman,
 14   can I make a motion to adjourn?
 15                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Second it?
 16                  COMMISSIONER CHOFFO:  Second it.
 17                  CHAIRMAN HOLLOWAY:  Adjourned.
 18           (At 8:25 p.m., proceedings were concluded.)
 19   
 20   
 21   
 22   
 23   
 24   
 25   
00081
  1   
  2                  C E R T I F I C A T E
  3             I, MICHELLE GRUENDEL, a Notary Public and
  4   Certified Shorthand Reporter of the State of New
  5   Jersey do hereby CERTIFY that the foregoing is a true
  6   and accurate transcript of the testimony as taken
  7   stenographically by and before me at the time, place
  8   and on the date hereinbefore set forth, to the best
  9   of my ability.
 10                  I DO FURTHER TESTIFY that I am neither
 11   a relative, nor employee, nor attorney, nor counsel
 12   of any parties to this action, and that I am neither
 13   a relative nor employee of such attorney or counsel,
 14   and that I am not financially interested in the
 15   action.
 16   
 17   
 18                           MICHELLE GRUENDEL, C.S.R.
                              License No. XI01905
 19   
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 21   
 22   
 23   
 24   
 25